The War Plan

[Porthos1]

@Foxhound: I would agree that Exo is not a troll. He does troll every now and then, but both you and I do that on occasion. He also does start very interesting threads and most do have great points; I read most of what he writes. Some I have really liked. This first post of this thread was extremely well thought out. But, the key element to this fiction is that our species is in a bind of our own doing and Unobtainium is our salvation. Further, because of the extinction idea, we will do whatever it takes to obtain what is "rightfully" ours, at all costs, even causing the extermination of the Na'vi. I find this theme, and it is one he continuously puts into his threads, distasteful. Wanting to see such an ugly ending to the Avatar time line makes me ill and I will point out how unbelievably twisted this theme is every time it pops up on the Avatar Forum. Sorry, that is me. Its not personal. There was death and destruction in the movie Avatar, but that was not the message we should have walked out of the theater with!

"Exo is just pointing out what MAY happen. Not necessarily what he would want to happen."

I do not know what Exo is saying, maybe he will enlighten us on this, but his posts say otherwise. "May" assumes that the time line we know remains the same. What his texts promote is that he wishes Unobtainium to be a key factor in human survival and a big fat and happy extermination drill is what he wants to happen on Pandora.

[Wind12]

This might be a dumb question and if so I apologize... but,do we even use the unobtanium up? As from what I see it itself isn't really the fuel( it is just used to deal with the heat from the fuel we are using) If it is something that dosn't get burned up then that would also lessen the whole, civilization will collapse if we stop getting more. I think it would serve humanity much better if we didn't plan a decades long interstellar war on the Na'vi for some rock and instead used that will and capital on say getting more energy out of that big continuousy running thermonuclear reactor that is sitting in the middle of our solar system.

[exostrike]

Yes, but what we use for unobtainium is increaseing. its clear from the expanded universe that earth is reaching the later stages of resources depletion, RDA is digging up the ocean trenchs for christs sake. To solve this problem they are turning to off planet mines to supply the basic raw materials. For this to be economical we need affordable fussion rockets, something that unobtainium provides.


Solar space flight is too slow to be economically. Solar panel feed ion engines would mean ships would take years to reach their targets instead of the months of fusion rockets. This means the overall rate of resources would be lower and therefore more rockets are required, but this of course requires more resources from the off world mine. Created a grim cycle of resources shortfall and economic problems back on earth. Fast fusion rockets are the only way of balancing cost with speed.

[Aihwa]

This might be a dumb question and if so I apologize... but,do we even use the unobtanium up? As from what I see it itself isn't really the fuel( it is just used to deal with the heat from the fuel we are using) If it is something that dosn't get burned up then that would also lessen the whole, civilization will collapse if we stop getting more. I think it would serve humanity much better if we didn't plan a decades long interstellar war on the Na'vi for some rock and instead used that will and capital on say getting more energy out of that big continuousy running thermonuclear reactor that is sitting in the middle of our solar system.

Need it for superconductors, more unobtainium = bigger fleets and more power generation.

[_Omaticaya_]

I think it would serve humanity much better if we didn't plan a decades long interstellar war on the Na'vi for some rock and instead used that will and capital on say getting more energy out of that big continuousy running thermonuclear reactor that is sitting in the middle of our solar system.

Exactly... If only they could See that. Humans can see it very well, but they don't use eyes, they use wallets and greed.

Need it for superconductors, more unobtainium = bigger fleets and more power generation.

Yeah, but what exactly do humans need "more power generation" for? Don't they ever stop and wonder what the **** are we aiming for?
They made nuclear bombs, ok fine. Result? Just Killing thousands of their same species. How can this lust for power, and trying to make Humanity incredible and invincible, be Legit, if we make weapons to kill ourselves anyway?
Oh wait, they also use the generation of power to land on beautiful Moons and exploit them and kill innocent tribes whom had lived for eternity in peace and Harmony until humans came. Good One indeed. A Good reason.

Instead if we used the money and science as Wind said for example, that would enhance Everyone's life.

[Aihwa]

Exactly... If only they could See that. Humans can see it very well, but they don't use eyes, they use wallets and greed.



Yeah, but what exactly do humans need "more power generation" for? Don't they ever stop and wonder what the **** are we aiming for?
They made nuclear bombs, ok fine. Result? Just Killing thousands of their same species. How can this lust for power, and trying to make Humanity incredible and invincible, be Legit, if we make weapons to kill ourselves anyway?
Oh wait, they also use the generation of power to land on beautiful Moons and exploit them and kill innocent tribes whom had lived for eternity in peace and Harmony until humans came. Good One indeed. A Good reason.

Instead if we used the money and science as Wind said for example, that would enhance Everyone's life.

For the same reason we climb mountains. Because its there.

[_Omaticaya_]

For the same reason we climb mountains. Because its there.

Fair enough mate. Thankyou for your reply.

Yet I have just one more thought; I understand you and agree perfectly for once, as it made me think. It's like, me for example, just a regular person that likes boxing, and dreams to be a champion someday. There's not really a reason for it, if not the fact that the Titles, are there, and they are physical Simbols, of Virtual achievements, aren't they? That is what I came up to reading your interesting words, let me know if I'm wrong.

So I can give you that, but I disagree on the fact that One thing, such as My personal Dream, does Not, influence Others. While what the big parties, leaders, corps in this world do, Does. That is my point. it comes down to Virtues and human nature again. You're either Humble, and (Figuratively speaking) Climb your Own mountain, alone, not bothering anyone, like any dreamer likes or tries to, or You are Evil and Selfish, and you constrict innocent lives to suffer for someone elses dream, which also, does not have 'positive' goals, honestly speaking.

[Aihwa]

Fair enough mate. Thankyou for your reply.

Yet I have just one more thought; I understand you and agree perfectly for once, as it made me think. It's like, me for example, just a regular person that likes boxing, and dreams to be a champion someday. There's not really a reason for it, if not the fact that the Titles, are there, and they are physical Simbols, of Virtual achievements, aren't they? That is what I came up to reading your interesting words, let me know if I'm wrong.

So I can give you that, but I disagree on the fact that One thing, such as My personal Dream, does Not, influence Others. While what the big parties, leaders, corps in this world do, Does. That is my point. it comes down to Virtues and human nature again. You're either Humble, and (Figuratively speaking) Climb your Own mountain, alone, not bothering anyone, like any dreamer likes or tries to, or You are Evil and Selfish, and you constrict innocent lives to suffer for someone elses dream, which also, does not have 'positive' goals, honestly speaking.

That depends on who you consider worthy of respect.


Do you consider the billions of bacteria you slaughter every day to be equals?

Some people do.

Others draw the line at insects.

Others at small animals.

Others at large animals.

Still more at farm animals.

Some at sentience.

Others at species. (Ave Imperator)

And some persist in only respecting others petty things like skin color or sexual orientation.

[_Omaticaya_]

That depends on who you consider worthy of respect.


Do you consider the billions of bacteria you slaughter every day to be equals?

Some people do.

Others draw the line at insects.

Others at small animals.

Others at large animals.

Still more at farm animals.

Some at sentience.

Others at species. (Ave Imperator)

And some persist in only respecting others petty things like skin color or sexual orientation.

Cool. So, I promise mate, I'm just trying to have a discussion here, I like it when we can talk peacefully, or better, as You're always calm actually, when I can stay calm aswell (rare).

So therefore, using my example, I can't really compare it. As my Plan, would not involve who I give respect to, as I am "selfishly" maybe, caring only for my personal success. And in any case, I'd respect the opponents, for example. But this is a 'close knit' example.

On the other hand, you have let's say someone like Quaritch or so, someone with much power, on an alien planet, that beholds let's say 'Humanity's Flag' in the universe. Apparently figthing to defend humanity and enhance It's name in the Universe, or something like that. Do you mean that he has no mercy as he doesn't consider animals, forests, or even humanoids, ('inferior races' such as the Na'vi in his opinion), worthy of enough respect, to stop his plans, and consider murder valid, for His ideals?

Connecting to your previous post. Do You think that it is 'Okay' to do what the Humans did on Pandora, simply because, (just as a World Boxing title is there, to be reached by someone), in the same way, Humanity can put Values and morality aside, to own 'sovereignty' over another population, and/or Planet, because it is an Opportunity, and because they are considered unworthy of respect?
So that is like, freedom at the Infinite, somehow. But cannot be right, ever in my opinion.

[Ja'k Dawsiin]

Humans can see it very well, but they don't use eyes, they use wallets and greed.

this is true, so very true. *sighs*...if only we could See the error and destruction of our ways, as a species collective.